giffords and the people around her. some of those same people are here today, victims, families, crying out for at least a dialogue, a sensible, rshl conversation, a national discussion where we're not afraid to call it like it it is. and that means to bring everybody to the table. that also means, piers and i think everybody will agree, it means cutting down the straw men that are raised up when people get freaked out about this conversation. this is not about taking people's guns away. it's not about taking the hunter agency gun, not about the sporting gun, not about the private protection gun. it is about sensible gun laws. semiautomatic weapons, the kinds of things that make killing industrial strength. there will always be these incidences, as tom ridge just said, but you don't have to have industrial strength killing. i'll tell you, there is cause and effect. there is other countries which have faced similar such massacres and they've taken procedures and it's worked.